I need to use PY ratings to score a particular regatta, but I also want to incorporate progressive handicap for the helmsman. Is there a way to do this? I can only select one option in the “Scoring system” pane.
Hi Mir,
Yes there is a way to do what you want. You need to use the ‘Alias’ functionality available in Sailwave.
The functionality need to be made available, go to Setup | User interface and check the box alongside ‘Competitor aliasing’,
By creating aliases of your competitors and labelling them as a different fleet you can then apply different rating systems to the two fleets by configuring things using the Fleets tab on scoring system.
You will only have to enter the finish sheet data once for each primary competitor, t he data is copied automatically to the alias of the competitor.
Kind regards,
Huw
Hi Mir
Yes you can do what you want to do this you will need to enable Aliases
Got to setup - User interface and enable Aliases and then generate Aliases for the competitors that you want to be in the Progressive handicap system
Rename the fleet for the Aliases to whatever you would like to use e.g. Progressive
Then on the Edit Scoring System select the Fleets Tab and click New Fleet and edit this fleet
For the new fleet you can select RYA NHC and internal
Untick the Inherit that is shown bottom left
Also make sure the Auto set Competitor ratings is unticked
I notice in your screen shot that it is ticked - I don’t recommend leaving this ticked you should only tick it when you want to change the ratings as per a new set and once you have scored it once then I advise that you leave it unticked
Now you can score and will have two sets of results one using PY and one using Progressive - You only enter the results once for the PY and the rest is all automatic
Any questions please ask
Jon
Hi,
That makes sense however I think I didn’t phrase my question correctly.
What I really want to do is use PY for boat handicaps, and have a way to add in a progressive (NHC) handicap for the helm, so that the corrected time reflects both the PY of the vessel, and progressive handicap of the helmsman. That is, the final result of each race accounts for both PY and Helmsman Prog. HC, and there is only ‘one’ rank.
Best,
Murtaza
Hi Mir
That is fine - If you supply a PY rating for the rating of the progressive fleet then Sailwave is clever enough to recognise this and it will convert the PY to a TCF to do the NHC algorithm and then convert it back so effectively it works automatically in PY ratings
I don’t understand how you have just one Rank you can either score using a static rating or a rating that changes after each race (progressive) Sailwave will allow you to publish both or either
If you think that you could explain in a bit more detail please do.
Thought I should clarify a little more, what I understood was that: when selecting RYA-PY to get ratings of the vessels, those ratings are no longer updated throughout the regatta.
What I understand now: Those initial RYA-PY ratings for vessels ARE updated (internally) and automatically throughout the regatta, based on past performance in the regatta (like NHC does for one-design races)
If I have understood correctly, then once I have selected RYA-PY for scoring then I don’t need to do any more leg work.
Allow me some time to implement your recommendation in the first reply, and hopefully this will make more sense to me. Thanks for your help, will lyk if it’s still not what I’m looking for 
Hi Mir,
If you select NHC then the ratings will get updated after each race - just follow the instructions in my first reply and although NHC is based on TCF ratings if you supply a PY rating Sailwave will automatically do the necessary conversions. If you select PY as the rating system then it will be static throughout the series.
If you don’t want the Static rating results then you don’t need to create the Aliases just change the rating system to NHC. A lot of clubs like to publish both as it keeps the newcomers happy as well as the ones that want to be scored purely on their performance.
Hi Huw,
I have implemented what you described, and I now understand that RYA NHC actually modifies the PY handicap (converted to a TCF) as the series progresses to slowly make it harder for the better sailors/boats to win, as you very carefully explained. I mistakenly assumed that NHC can only work with one-design racing. (did I get that right?)
The regatta results look like the following, one with only RYA-PY, and one with NHC Progressive handicaps. I expected there to be more of a difference between the two results, does it look right to you? ( I have sent the raw csv I used to import results via email)
PS:
I had to score the series once with RYAPY with “Auto set competitor ratings” before creating the aliases, so that (I presume) those PY ratings become the base ratings for the NHC scoring. I then de-select “Auto set comp…” And score the series again.
When I try to create a new series and score only using NHC, I get the error “Cannot find rating value for NHC1/470 in rating files”. Which confuses me because I expect it to automatically use the PY ratings
Hi Mir
Ticking the “auto set competitor ratings” box causes Sailwave to replace the rating for all competitor’s with the new ratings being read from ratings files when the series is scored. This box should not normally be left ticked. The idea is if you are starting a new series using an existing file and let’s assume it is a new year where the ratings have changed then ticking this box will update the ratings to the new ratings for this year. Once the race has been scored you should then untick this box. If you get the error you mention it is because you have this box ticked and the rating dies not exist in any of the rating files in the specified directory.
With NHC the base rating is normal the standard PY or TCF rating for that class Sailwave will then use that for race 1 (assuming that you have not manually set the rating for race 1)
Sailwave will set the ratings for R2 based on the results of R1. Etc
If a a series is a continuation of a previous series then the base ratings will still be the same but the ratings you use for race 1 will be the ratings that were calculated as the new ratings in the earlier series. You can do this easily with Sailwave. Assume you have a spring series with 6 races you don’t specify any ratings for R1, at the end of the 6 races. R7 will contain the new ratings. So make a copy of the series file and delete races 1-6. So R7 will now be R1 and contain the ratings ready to go.
Okay so I get the workflow with Sailwave, and how to keep progressive ratings updated throughout the season. (i.e. copy the series, delete all but the last (empty) race and enter results) Thanks for the tip! I have a few more questions though:
Q1)
What I meant to ask was the ‘NHC1’ column for the fleet using the NHC rating system contains what looks like PY handicaps, is that normal?
Q2)
In my club we have weekly (standalone) races, and I would like to only update the handicaps once a month, and only if the helm has sailed at least 2 races that month. So I guess I can’t just use the same sailwave series file as described above, I will have to work out a handicap outside of sailwave, and integrate that in somehow? (more on this later)
Q3)
I import series results using a csv, so I guess I will inevitably create aliases after all the results are entered for the first fleet. Does this effect anything?
Q4)
You mentioned:
If I had supplied my own rating, say it is my clubs custom rating (suppose further that it is the PY rating divided by 10 and the other calculations remain the same except with a factor of 100 * elapsed-time instead of 1000), would selecting NHC update those ratings the same way it updates the PY rating? (i.e how does sailwave convert to a TCF?)
Q5)
I want to tweak the PY ratings in the ratings file to account for some of our older boats which race in the same ‘class’ in our weekly race. (These are independent races and not part of a regatta). I plan to create a new classes like ‘OLD_ENTERPRISE’, ‘NEW_ENTERPRISE’, ‘03121_ENTERPRISE’, which have handicaps either manually set, or set using some calculation of the past performance.
In this scenario, would I select ‘auto set competitor ratings’ after I update the handicaps in the ratings file? (Similarly for a regatta I may select it once to load the ratings and then turn it off)
Q6)
I may also incorporate a helm handicap (perhaps a percentage or an index) which modifies the PY handicap used for scoring. In this scenario I will make a function in excel which modifies the rating automatically for each boat according to the helm HC, and store that in the ‘ratings’ column as the results are entered. (a) I assume that when the csv is imported to sailwave it will treat my ratings the same way as it does the default the PY ratings, and the NHC scheme will proceed normally if it is a series. (b) Have you seen anyone incorporate a helm handicap in this way before? Do you see any issues with this?
I really do appreciate the help folks, I think we’re close to fully switching over to Sailwave 