Excluding Races in a Series Longer that a Regatta

I am currently using sailwave for my small clubs' series scoring, and
love it! But I have one problem that I haven't been able to work
around - I've searched your message archives as well, and haven't
found an answer yet. Here are the specifics of my clubs scoring method:

20 race series
low point system
50% qualification
2 throw outs (after qualification is met)
races not sailed do not count at all

And that is my problem. No matter how I try to fix it, sailwave
counts the race when determining the Nett (point average). I would
like to have a way that the race is scored as a 0, and not counted as
a race in the Nett. Is there a way to accomplish this?

Your system cannot work 0 is a better result than a 1st place…

Just think high point… Even ISAF does for the rankings.

ISAF rankings are…

  • points for the regatta (read race for SW) = 101-place
  • several coefficients applied (up to 11.25)
  • worse 10% / 30% / 50% of a regatta (race) don’t receive points
  • best 7 results of the last 2 years are added

Does not work properly for your club series.

An example of simple high point is…

  • n = nb of entries, s = nb of starters, p = place

  • points = s-p+2

  • DNF, DNS (but was in the starting area), OCS, DSQ = 1 (complies with RRS, points for the number of starters +1)

  • DNC = 0
    Another one…

  • points = n-p+1

  • DNF and associate codes = n-s

  • DNC = 0
    but this one gives more points for a DNS with 4 starters than a DNF for 40 starters…

Or…

  • points = max(101-p,2) (simplified to points = 101-p if less than 100 entries expected, 2)
  • DNS and associate codes = max(100-s,1) or just 100-s
  • DNC = 0
    You can develop on points = 100*s/p (1st 100, last 1, others are equally spread)

and there are pre-programmed high point systems in SW, but the right treatment of codes is not in always what SW proposes.

Phil

···

----- Original Message -----
From: “joninc” john.incantalupo@gmail.com

To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 6:46 PM

Subject: [sailwave] Excluding Races in a Series Longer that a Regatta

I am currently using sailwave for my small clubs’ series scoring, and
love it! But I have one problem that I haven’t been able to work
around - I’ve searched your message archives as well, and haven’t
found an answer yet. Here are the specifics of my clubs scoring method:

20 race series
low point system
50% qualification
2 throw outs (after qualification is met)
races not sailed do not count at all

And that is my problem. No matter how I try to fix it, sailwave
counts the race when determining the Nett (point average). I would
like to have a way that the race is scored as a 0, and not counted as
a race in the Nett. Is there a way to accomplish this?


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-!- http://www.sailing.org/ -!- http://www.sailwave.com/
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Thank you so much for your quick reply!

The problems for me, Phillippe, are quite numerous.

Firstly, the club that I've joined here at home is 35 years old, and
is a small Lightning Fleet. They (the old timers) have been scoring
their series the same way for the last 30 years - and I am NOT in a
position to change their scoring system or suggest a new way to do
things - at 47 years old, I am considered the "new kid" on the block.
It was enough for me to suggest we use a scoring program on a
computer to start with!

Nextly, I guess what I am getting at is not that I want to score a "0"
for a boat that did not sail a particlar race in the series - I just
don't want to score ANYTHING for that boat in that race, and not have
the program include that missed race in the total points or in the
Nett - at all.

But I would like the program to add up the points for the races sailed
- throw out the proper number of races, and give me a points average
(Nett) that isn't affected by any races that were missed. Does this
make any sense to any one out there!!!

Thank you all for taking the time to read my messages and for your
kind replies - I would really like to get the sailwave program to
conform to our antiquated scoring method - I love using the program
and being able to publish a professional looking results table both on
paper and eventually to our clubs website.

Your system cannot work 0 is a better result than a 1st place...
Just think high point... Even ISAF does for the rankings.

ISAF rankings are...
  a.. points for the regatta (read race for SW) = 101-place
  b.. several coefficients applied (up to 11.25)
  c.. worse 10% / 30% / 50% of a regatta (race) don't receive points
  d.. best 7 results of the last 2 years are added

Does not work properly for your club series.
An example of simple high point is...
  a.. n = nb of entries, s = nb of starters, p = place
  b.. points = s-p+2
  c.. DNF, DNS (but was in the starting area), OCS, DSQ = 1

(complies with RRS, points for the number of starters +1)

  d.. DNC = 0
Another one...
  a.. points = n-p+1
  b.. DNF and associate codes = n-s
  c.. DNC = 0
but this one gives more points for a DNS with 4 starters than a DNF

for 40 starters...

Or...
  a.. points = max(101-p,2) (simplified to points = 101-p if less

than 100 entries expected, 2)

  b.. DNS and associate codes = max(100-s,1) or just 100-s
  c.. DNC = 0
You can develop on points = 100*s/p (1st 100, last 1, others are

equally spread)

and there are pre-programmed high point systems in SW, but the right

treatment of codes is not in always what SW proposes.

Phil

From: "joninc" <john.incantalupo@...>
To: <sailwave@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 6:46 PM
Subject: [sailwave] Excluding Races in a Series Longer that a Regatta

>I am currently using sailwave for my small clubs' series scoring, and
> love it! But I have one problem that I haven't been able to work
> around - I've searched your message archives as well, and haven't
> found an answer yet. Here are the specifics of my clubs scoring

method:

>
> 20 race series
> low point system
> 50% qualification
> 2 throw outs (after qualification is met)
> races not sailed do not count at all
>
> And that is my problem. No matter how I try to fix it, sailwave
> counts the race when determining the Nett (point average). I would
> like to have a way that the race is scored as a 0, and not counted as
> a race in the Nett. Is there a way to accomplish this?
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> -!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/

-!- http://www.sailwave.com/ -!-

>
> Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files'

section at

···

--- In sailwave@yahoogroups.com, "Philippe De Troy" <philippe@...> wrote:

----- Original Message -----
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
>
> On-Line Sailwave help...
> http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
>
> Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
> sailwave-digest@...! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

Then be logical.
Score DNC's as 0 points is wrong.
Score DNF as s+1
Score DNC as n+1
33 boats in the series, 21 in a race, 22 points for DNF/DNS/OCS/DSQ and 34 points for DNC.

Phil

···

----- Original Message ----- From: "joninc" <john.incantalupo@gmail.com>
To: <sailwave@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 7:42 PM
Subject: [sailwave] Re: Excluding Races in a Series Longer that a Regatta

Thank you so much for your quick reply!

The problems for me, Phillippe, are quite numerous.

Firstly, the club that I've joined here at home is 35 years old, and
is a small Lightning Fleet. They (the old timers) have been scoring
their series the same way for the last 30 years - and I am NOT in a
position to change their scoring system or suggest a new way to do
things - at 47 years old, I am considered the "new kid" on the block.
It was enough for me to suggest we use a scoring program on a
computer to start with!

Nextly, I guess what I am getting at is not that I want to score a "0"
for a boat that did not sail a particlar race in the series - I just
don't want to score ANYTHING for that boat in that race, and not have
the program include that missed race in the total points or in the
Nett - at all.

But I would like the program to add up the points for the races sailed
- throw out the proper number of races, and give me a points average
(Nett) that isn't affected by any races that were missed. Does this
make any sense to any one out there!!!

Thank you all for taking the time to read my messages and for your
kind replies - I would really like to get the sailwave program to
conform to our antiquated scoring method - I love using the program
and being able to publish a professional looking results table both on
paper and eventually to our clubs website.

--- In sailwave@yahoogroups.com, "Philippe De Troy" <philippe@...> wrote:

Your system cannot work 0 is a better result than a 1st place...
Just think high point... Even ISAF does for the rankings.

ISAF rankings are...
  a.. points for the regatta (read race for SW) = 101-place
  b.. several coefficients applied (up to 11.25)
  c.. worse 10% / 30% / 50% of a regatta (race) don't receive points
  d.. best 7 results of the last 2 years are added

Does not work properly for your club series.
An example of simple high point is...
  a.. n = nb of entries, s = nb of starters, p = place
  b.. points = s-p+2
  c.. DNF, DNS (but was in the starting area), OCS, DSQ = 1

(complies with RRS, points for the number of starters +1)

  d.. DNC = 0
Another one...
  a.. points = n-p+1
  b.. DNF and associate codes = n-s
  c.. DNC = 0
but this one gives more points for a DNS with 4 starters than a DNF

for 40 starters...

Or...
  a.. points = max(101-p,2) (simplified to points = 101-p if less

than 100 entries expected, 2)

  b.. DNS and associate codes = max(100-s,1) or just 100-s
  c.. DNC = 0
You can develop on points = 100*s/p (1st 100, last 1, others are

equally spread)

and there are pre-programmed high point systems in SW, but the right

treatment of codes is not in always what SW proposes.

Phil

----- Original Message ----- From: "joninc" <john.incantalupo@...>
To: <sailwave@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 6:46 PM
Subject: [sailwave] Excluding Races in a Series Longer that a Regatta

>I am currently using sailwave for my small clubs' series scoring, and
> love it! But I have one problem that I haven't been able to work
> around - I've searched your message archives as well, and haven't
> found an answer yet. Here are the specifics of my clubs scoring

method:

>
> 20 race series
> low point system
> 50% qualification
> 2 throw outs (after qualification is met)
> races not sailed do not count at all
>
> And that is my problem. No matter how I try to fix it, sailwave
> counts the race when determining the Nett (point average). I would
> like to have a way that the race is scored as a 0, and not counted as
> a race in the Nett. Is there a way to accomplish this?
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> -!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/

-!- http://www.sailwave.com/ -!-

>
> Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files'

section at

> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
>
> On-Line Sailwave help...
> http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
>
> Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
> sailwave-digest@...! Groups Links
>

------------------------------------

-!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/ -!- http://www.sailwave.com/ -!-

Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files' section at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/

On-Line Sailwave help...
http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/

Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
sailwave-digest@yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links

Thanks again for your quick reply Phillippe!

Unfortunately, logic isn't in the picture here (otherwise I would just
use a DNR formula that adds averages points of all races - not skewing
the Nett in the end - but adding points to the point total).

Is there any one else out there that scores races like my club does
and uses sailwave to do it???

Then be logical.
Score DNC's as 0 points is wrong.
Score DNF as s+1
Score DNC as n+1
33 boats in the series, 21 in a race, 22 points for DNF/DNS/OCS/DSQ

and 34

points for DNC.

Phil

From: "joninc" <john.incantalupo@...>
To: <sailwave@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 7:42 PM
Subject: [sailwave] Re: Excluding Races in a Series Longer that a

Regatta

> Thank you so much for your quick reply!
>
> The problems for me, Phillippe, are quite numerous.
>
> Firstly, the club that I've joined here at home is 35 years old, and
> is a small Lightning Fleet. They (the old timers) have been scoring
> their series the same way for the last 30 years - and I am NOT in a
> position to change their scoring system or suggest a new way to do
> things - at 47 years old, I am considered the "new kid" on the block.
> It was enough for me to suggest we use a scoring program on a
> computer to start with!
>
> Nextly, I guess what I am getting at is not that I want to score a "0"
> for a boat that did not sail a particlar race in the series - I just
> don't want to score ANYTHING for that boat in that race, and not have
> the program include that missed race in the total points or in the
> Nett - at all.
>
> But I would like the program to add up the points for the races sailed
> - throw out the proper number of races, and give me a points average
> (Nett) that isn't affected by any races that were missed. Does this
> make any sense to any one out there!!!
>
> Thank you all for taking the time to read my messages and for your
> kind replies - I would really like to get the sailwave program to
> conform to our antiquated scoring method - I love using the program
> and being able to publish a professional looking results table both on
> paper and eventually to our clubs website.
>
>
>>
>> Your system cannot work 0 is a better result than a 1st place…
>> Just think high point… Even ISAF does for the rankings.
>>
>> ISAF rankings are…
>> a… points for the regatta (read race for SW) = 101-place
>> b… several coefficients applied (up to 11.25)
>> c… worse 10% / 30% / 50% of a regatta (race) don't receive points
>> d… best 7 results of the last 2 years are added
>>
>> Does not work properly for your club series.
>> An example of simple high point is…
>> a… n = nb of entries, s = nb of starters, p = place
>> b… points = s-p+2
>> c… DNF, DNS (but was in the starting area), OCS, DSQ = 1
> (complies with RRS, points for the number of starters +1)
>> d… DNC = 0
>> Another one…
>> a… points = n-p+1
>> b… DNF and associate codes = n-s
>> c… DNC = 0
>> but this one gives more points for a DNS with 4 starters than a DNF
> for 40 starters…
>>
>> Or…
>> a… points = max(101-p,2) (simplified to points = 101-p if less
> than 100 entries expected, 2)
>> b… DNS and associate codes = max(100-s,1) or just 100-s
>> c… DNC = 0
>> You can develop on points = 100*s/p (1st 100, last 1, others are
> equally spread)
>>
>> and there are pre-programmed high point systems in SW, but the right
> treatment of codes is not in always what SW proposes.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>> From: "joninc" <john.incantalupo@>
>> To: <sailwave@yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 6:46 PM
>> Subject: [sailwave] Excluding Races in a Series Longer that a Regatta
>>
>>
>> >I am currently using sailwave for my small clubs' series

scoring, and

>> > love it! But I have one problem that I haven't been able to work
>> > around - I've searched your message archives as well, and haven't
>> > found an answer yet. Here are the specifics of my clubs scoring
> method:
>> >
>> > 20 race series
>> > low point system
>> > 50% qualification
>> > 2 throw outs (after qualification is met)
>> > races not sailed do not count at all
>> >
>> > And that is my problem. No matter how I try to fix it, sailwave
>> > counts the race when determining the Nett (point average). I would
>> > like to have a way that the race is scored as a 0, and not

counted as

>> > a race in the Nett. Is there a way to accomplish this?
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------------
>> >
>> > -!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/
> -!- http://www.sailwave.com/ -!-
>> >
>> > Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files'
> section at
>> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
>> >
>> > On-Line Sailwave help...
>> > http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
>> >
>> > Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
>> > sailwave-digest@! Groups Links
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> -!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/ -!-
> http://www.sailwave.com/ -!-
>
> Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files'

section at

···

--- In sailwave@yahoogroups.com, "Philippe De Troy" <philippe@...> wrote:

----- Original Message -----
> --- In sailwave@yahoogroups.com, "Philippe De Troy" <philippe@> wrote:
>> ----- Original Message -----
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
>
> On-Line Sailwave help...
> http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
>
> Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
> sailwave-digest@...! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>