A small point, but after nearly 40 years as a crew (the intellectual role on any boat!) I may be hyper sensitive.
When we enter a new competitor the menu asks us to name helm and crew. Whilst I know that your average tiller waggler is a vain and touchy character and needs to have his/her fragile ego boosted this information is of little practical use. RRS 46 requires each boat to have a designated person in charge on board. This is the person that the race committee, jury etc need to know. I do hope we have got beyond the archaic and mistaken belief that the helm is automatically (by divine right?) in charge of the boat.
It would help if there was a means of designating the person in charge (or simply replace helm by person in charge).
Gordon
Bray Sailing Club
Ireland
I believe the appropriate term is skipper
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+skipper&btnG=Google+Search
However I don’t think it will help. Any time that I have tried to explain that someone on a boat, other than the helmsman, was the skipper, it has generally fallen upon deaf ears.
Regards,
Jamie
Ohio Catamaran Racing Association
USA
···
On 5/17/06, gordon davies gordondavies@eircom.net wrote:
A small point, but after nearly 40 years as a crew (the intellectual role on any boat!) I may be hyper sensitive.
When we enter a new competitor the menu asks us to name helm and crew. Whilst I know that your average tiller waggler is a vain and touchy character and needs to have his/her fragile ego boosted this information is of little practical use. RRS 46 requires each boat to have a designated person in charge on board. This is the person that the race committee, jury etc need to know. I do hope we have got beyond the archaic and mistaken belief that the helm is automatically (by divine right?) in charge of the boat.
It would help if there was a means of designating the person in charge (or simply replace helm by person in charge).
Gordon
Bray Sailing Club
Ireland
`
-!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!-
http://www.sailing.org/ -!- http://www.sailwave.com/ -!-
Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the ‘files’ section at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
On-Line Sailwave help…
http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
sailwave-digest@yahoogroups.com`
SPONSORED LINKS
[ Boating sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating+sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=AJ1MU046R4ys2uZlDjAdtQ)
[ Sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=1HQW16yAAPjllnOQiXMAUw)
[ Boating](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=bzpnMO-kE3ubzvL0EqcW5w)
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
``
-
Visit your group "[sailwave](http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave)" on the web.
``
-
` To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
sailwave-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
`
``
-
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the [Yahoo! Terms of Service](http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) .
–
Jamie Diamond
jamie.diamond@sailocra.com
I’ve been meaning to add a skipper field… so at least it’ll be there now…
CJ
···
-----Original Message-----
From: sailwave@yahoogroups.com [mailto:sailwave@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Jamie Diamond
Sent: 17 May 2006 11:58
To:
sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
I believe the appropriate term is skipper
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+skipper&btnG=Google+Search
However I don’t think it will help. Any time that I have tried to explain that someone on a boat, other than the helmsman, was the skipper, it has generally fallen upon deaf ears.
Regards,
Jamie
Ohio Catamaran Racing Association
USA
On 5/17/06, ** gordon davies** <gordondavies@eircom.net > wrote:
A small point, but after nearly 40 years as a crew (the intellectual role on any boat!) I may be hyper sensitive.
When we enter a new competitor the menu asks us to name helm and crew. Whilst I know that your average tiller waggler is a vain and touchy character and needs to have his/her fragile ego boosted this information is of little practical use. RRS 46 requires each boat to have a designated person in charge on board. This is the person that the race committee, jury etc need to know. I do hope we have got beyond the archaic and mistaken belief that the helm is automatically (by divine right?) in charge of the boat.
It would help if there was a means of designating the person in charge (or simply replace helm by person in charge).
Gordon
Bray Sailing Club
Ireland
`-!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/ -!- http://www.sailwave.com/
-!-
Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files' section at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
On-Line Sailwave help...
http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
sailwave-digest@yahoogroups.com`
SPONSORED LINKS
[Boating sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating+sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=AJ1MU046R4ys2uZlDjAdtQ)
[Sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=1HQW16yAAPjllnOQiXMAUw)
[Boating](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=bzpnMO-kE3ubzvL0EqcW5w)
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
``
-
Visit your group "[sailwave](http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave) " on the web. ``
-
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: sailwave-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
``
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the [ Yahoo! Terms of Service](http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) .
–
Jamie Diamond
jamie.diamond@sailocra.com
The term as used by RRS is person in charge (see RRS 46). It would seem that Anglo-Saxon culture has a problem with designating anyone else but the helm as the person in charge. But as long serving crew I would like to point out that when the helm busies himself with anything but the next wave, the compass, the tell-tales and generally doing as little as possible to slow the boat down then the boat isn’t fast…
My point was that as a race official I do not really need to know who is waggling the tiller - I need to know who is taking responsibility for the boat and the crew. In many cases this may be the helm, but, increasingly on boats with more than two crew, this is not the case.
Gordon
···
----- Original Message -----
From:
Jamie Diamond
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
I believe the appropriate term is skipper
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+skipper&btnG=Google+Search
However I don’t think it will help. Any time that I have tried to explain that someone on a boat, other than the helmsman, was the skipper, it has generally fallen upon deaf ears.
Regards,
Jamie
Ohio Catamaran Racing Association
USA
On 5/17/06, ** gordon davies** <gordondavies@eircom.net > wrote:
A small point, but after nearly 40 years as a crew (the intellectual role on any boat!) I may be hyper sensitive.
When we enter a new competitor the menu asks us to name helm and crew. Whilst I know that your average tiller waggler is a vain and touchy character and needs to have his/her fragile ego boosted this information is of little practical use. RRS 46 requires each boat to have a designated person in charge on board. This is the person that the race committee, jury etc need to know. I do hope we have got beyond the archaic and mistaken belief that the helm is automatically (by divine right?) in charge of the boat.
It would help if there was a means of designating the person in charge (or simply replace helm by person in charge).
Gordon
Bray Sailing Club
Ireland
`-!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/ -!- http://www.sailwave.com/
-!-
Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files' section at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
On-Line Sailwave help...
http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
sailwave-digest@yahoogroups.com`
SPONSORED LINKS
[Boating sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating+sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=AJ1MU046R4ys2uZlDjAdtQ)
[Sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=1HQW16yAAPjllnOQiXMAUw)
[Boating](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=bzpnMO-kE3ubzvL0EqcW5w)
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
``
-
Visit your group "[sailwave](http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave) " on the web. ``
-
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: sailwave-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
``
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the [ Yahoo! Terms of Service](http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) .
–
Jamie Diamond
jamie.diamond@sailocra.com
Hi Gordon,
Also on one of my todo lists (I hear you Mike :-)) is to restructure the helm/crew stuff; Sailwave was created specifically for racing at my club with is max two-person - hence the limitations.
The restructure would be of the form of N crew, each having a role, name, website, email, phone etc etc. The column heading would reflect the role i.e. ‘helm name’ or ‘skipper phone’ or ‘foredeck website’… etc etc.
Regards,
Colin Jenkins
www.sailwave.com
···
-----Original Message-----
From: sailwave@yahoogroups.com [mailto:sailwave@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of gordon davies
Sent: 17 May 2006 12:20
To:
sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
The term as used by RRS is person in charge (see RRS 46). It would seem that Anglo-Saxon culture has a problem with designating anyone else but the helm as the person in charge. But as long serving crew I would like to point out that when the helm busies himself with anything but the next wave, the compass, the tell-tales and generally doing as little as possible to slow the boat down then the boat isn’t fast…
My point was that as a race official I do not really need to know who is waggling the tiller - I need to know who is taking responsibility for the boat and the crew. In many cases this may be the helm, but, increasingly on boats with more than two crew, this is not the case.
Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From:
Jamie Diamond
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
I believe the appropriate term is skipper
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+skipper&btnG=Google+Search
However I don't think it will help. Any time that I have tried to explain that someone on a boat, other than the helmsman, was the skipper, it has generally fallen upon deaf ears.
Regards,
Jamie
Ohio Catamaran Racing Association
USA
On 5/17/06, ** gordon davies** <gordondavies@eircom.net > wrote:
A small point, but after nearly 40 years as a crew (the intellectual role on any boat!) I may be hyper sensitive.
When we enter a new competitor the menu asks us to name helm and crew. Whilst I know that your average tiller waggler is a vain and touchy character and needs to have his/her fragile ego boosted this information is of little practical use. RRS 46 requires each boat to have a designated person in charge on board. This is the person that the race committee, jury etc need to know. I do hope we have got beyond the archaic and mistaken belief that the helm is automatically (by divine right?) in charge of the boat.
It would help if there was a means of designating the person in charge (or simply replace helm by person in charge).
Gordon
Bray Sailing Club
Ireland
`-!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/
-!- http://www.sailwave.com/
-!-
Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files' section at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
On-Line Sailwave help...
http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
sailwave-digest@yahoogroups.com`
SPONSORED LINKS
[Boating sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating+sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=AJ1MU046R4ys2uZlDjAdtQ)
[Sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=1HQW16yAAPjllnOQiXMAUw)
[Boating](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=bzpnMO-kE3ubzvL0EqcW5w)
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
``
-
Visit your group "[sailwave](http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave)" on the web. ``
-
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: sailwave-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
``
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the [ Yahoo! Terms of Service](http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) .
–
Jamie Diamond
jamie.diamond@sailocra.com
Hi!
In this case I have to inform you that in a 29er, both sailors can change position at anytime. The only exception is that only one can be in the trapeze… So, who’s waggling the tiller may change at any time!
regards,
Martin
···
----- Original Message -----
From:
gordon davies
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:20 PM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
The term as used by RRS is person in charge (see RRS 46). It would seem that Anglo-Saxon culture has a problem with designating anyone else but the helm as the person in charge. But as long serving crew I would like to point out that when the helm busies himself with anything but the next wave, the compass, the tell-tales and generally doing as little as possible to slow the boat down then the boat isn’t fast…
My point was that as a race official I do not really need to know who is waggling the tiller - I need to know who is taking responsibility for the boat and the crew. In many cases this may be the helm, but, increasingly on boats with more than two crew, this is not the case.
Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From:
Jamie Diamond
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
I believe the appropriate term is skipper
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+skipper&btnG=Google+Search
However I don't think it will help. Any time that I have tried to explain that someone on a boat, other than the helmsman, was the skipper, it has generally fallen upon deaf ears.
Regards,
Jamie
Ohio Catamaran Racing Association
USA
On 5/17/06, ** gordon davies** <gordondavies@eircom.net > wrote:
A small point, but after nearly 40 years as a crew (the intellectual role on any boat!) I may be hyper sensitive.
When we enter a new competitor the menu asks us to name helm and crew. Whilst I know that your average tiller waggler is a vain and touchy character and needs to have his/her fragile ego boosted this information is of little practical use. RRS 46 requires each boat to have a designated person in charge on board. This is the person that the race committee, jury etc need to know. I do hope we have got beyond the archaic and mistaken belief that the helm is automatically (by divine right?) in charge of the boat.
It would help if there was a means of designating the person in charge (or simply replace helm by person in charge).
Gordon
Bray Sailing Club
Ireland
`-!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/
-!- http://www.sailwave.com/
-!-
Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files' section at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
On-Line Sailwave help...
http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
sailwave-digest@yahoogroups.com`
SPONSORED LINKS
[Boating sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating+sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=AJ1MU046R4ys2uZlDjAdtQ)
[Sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=1HQW16yAAPjllnOQiXMAUw)
[Boating](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=bzpnMO-kE3ubzvL0EqcW5w)
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
``
-
Visit your group "[sailwave](http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave)" on the web. ``
-
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: sailwave-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
``
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the [ Yahoo! Terms of Service](http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) .
–
Jamie Diamond
jamie.diamond@sailocra.com
In any case the first quality required of a good helmsman is total obedience to the crew! The second is always to pay the first round in the bar after the race…
Gordon
···
----- Original Message -----
From:
Martin Bølgen
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 6:25 PM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
Hi!
In this case I have to inform you that in a 29er, both sailors can change position at anytime. The only exception is that only one can be in the trapeze… So, who’s waggling the tiller may change at any time!
regards,
Martin
----- Original Message -----
From:
gordon davies
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:20 PM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
The term as used by RRS is person in charge (see RRS 46). It would seem that Anglo-Saxon culture has a problem with designating anyone else but the helm as the person in charge. But as long serving crew I would like to point out that when the helm busies himself with anything but the next wave, the compass, the tell-tales and generally doing as little as possible to slow the boat down then the boat isn't fast...
My point was that as a race official I do not really need to know who is waggling the tiller - I need to know who is taking responsibility for the boat and the crew. In many cases this may be the helm, but, increasingly on boats with more than two crew, this is not the case.
Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From:
Jamie Diamond
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] helm/person in charge
I believe the appropriate term is skipper
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+skipper&btnG=Google+Search
However I don't think it will help. Any time that I have tried to explain that someone on a boat, other than the helmsman, was the skipper, it has generally fallen upon deaf ears.
Regards,
Jamie
Ohio Catamaran Racing Association
USA
On 5/17/06, ** gordon davies** <gordondavies@eircom.net > wrote:
A small point, but after nearly 40 years as a crew (the intellectual role on any boat!) I may be hyper sensitive.
When we enter a new competitor the menu asks us to name helm and crew. Whilst I know that your average tiller waggler is a vain and touchy character and needs to have his/her fragile ego boosted this information is of little practical use. RRS 46 requires each boat to have a designated person in charge on board. This is the person that the race committee, jury etc need to know. I do hope we have got beyond the archaic and mistaken belief that the helm is automatically (by divine right?) in charge of the boat.
It would help if there was a means of designating the person in charge (or simply replace helm by person in charge).
Gordon
Bray Sailing Club
Ireland
`-!- http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/ -!- http://www.sailing.org/
-!- http://www.sailwave.com/ -!-
Latest versions of sailwave can be downloaded from the 'files' section at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave/
On-Line Sailwave help...
http://sailwave.com/help/HTML/
Convert to daily digest of emails send blank email to:
sailwave-digest@yahoogroups.com`
SPONSORED LINKS
[Boating sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating+sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=AJ1MU046R4ys2uZlDjAdtQ)
[Sailing](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=1HQW16yAAPjllnOQiXMAUw)
[Boating](http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Sailing&w3=Boating&c=3&s=47&.sig=bzpnMO-kE3ubzvL0EqcW5w)
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
``
-
Visit your group "[sailwave](http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailwave)" on the web. ``
-
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: sailwave-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
``
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the [ Yahoo! Terms of Service](http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) .
–
Jamie Diamond
jamie.diamond@sailocra.com