[sailwave] Re: Qualifications and finals

Martin_Bolgen · 29 June 2005 10:57

You'll maybe want to have your holiday i Norway?

No problem Scoring. I'll manage it anyway, and SW will help me.

regards Martin

···

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Colin Jenkins" <colin@sailwave.com>
Reply-To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 11:50:06 +0100

<html><body>

<tt>

All this is useful to ME! 
 
I'll maybe score the European Youth Championships 2005 
(<a href="http://www.tonsbergseilforening.no/)">http://www.tonsbergseilforening.no/)</a> later this summer. So, then 
I have the ability to really test SW. 

 
I think I may be away ... :-) 
 
CJ 
 

-----Original Message----- 
From: sailwave@yahoogroups.com [mailto:sailwave@yahoogroups.com]On 
Behalf Of Martin Bølgen 
Sent: 29 June 2005 11:42 
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: RE: [sailwave] Re: Qualifications and finals 
 
 
 
Hi, Ralph & Colin. 
 
All this is useful to ME! 
 
I'll maybe score the European Youth Championships 2005 
(<a href="http://www.tonsbergseilforening.no/)">http://www.tonsbergseilforening.no/)</a> later this summer. So, then 
I have the ability to really test SW. 
 
Regards, Martin 
 
---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- 
From: "Ralph Tingle" <rat@attat.com> 
Reply-To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com 
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 10:25:44 +0100 
 
><html><body> 
> 
> 
><tt> 
>Hi Colin 
>Spent last week downloading results from Kiel so that I can 
develop some sample data & also test the 
>new flights system in SW. 
>I have also managed to get a copy of the SIs with a couple of 
interesting points re the finals: 
> 
>POINTS 
>Gold fleet is simple low points system, Silver is low points 
plus points equal to number of Gold 
>competitors, Bronze is low points plus number of gold & silver 
competitors etc etc 
>I suspect that this is because their scoring system could not 
handle separate 'fleets' & they needed 
>to ensure that 1st in the next fleet was always higher points 
than last in the previous (higher) - I 
>will confirm this when I work through the results. 
>This comment is for interest only as SW should not need this as 
it can 'score by fleet'. 
> 
>DISCARDS 
>The discard profiles (5-7 one disc, 8 & more two disc) are 
applied to the Qualifications & Finals 
>separately. 
>This is similar to Add C but easier to understand. I personally 
prefer this method as it is much 
>fairer & simpler. 
>I seem to remember that you have yet to deal with this issue in SW. 
> 
>I feel a bit guilty that I have not tested SW re flights but I 
am in the process of packing & moving 
>house etc. 
>I plan to set up and input all the 49er results from Kiel (along 
with amendments etc) & then check 
>them against the published results 
>When everything is OK my objective is to create a set of csv 
files etc & a final blw file so that 
>they can be made available on the SW web site. IS THIS USEFUL 
FOR OTHERS??? 
>Also, if I have time, I will try & produce the data for both 
49er (2 groups) & Laser (4 groups) 
> 
>In the meantime, monitoring Martin's comments with interest 
> 
> 
>Regards 
>Ralph 
> 
> 
> 
>-----Original Message----- 
>From: Colin Jenkins [mailto:colin@sailwave.com] 
>Sent: 29 June 2005 09:44 
>To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com 
>Subject: RE: [sailwave] Re: Qualifications and finals 
> 
> 
>Hi Jan et al, 
> 
>> So the proposal from Anders : "switch to lock the results in a 
race" 
>> makes a lot of sense to me but of course I cannot judge what 
impact it 
>> would have on the development work. Beeing in the sw business 
I know 
>> that there are no easy changes, just a lot of unrealistic 
demands… 
> 
>Version 1.72 can now handle seeding, qualifications and finals flight 
>(re)assignments. 
> 
>Regards, 
>Colin J 
>www.sailwave.com 
> 
> 
>> -----Original Message----- 
>> From: sailwave@yahoogroups.com [mailto:sailwave@yahoogroups.com]On 
>> Behalf Of jan_vasternas 
>> Sent: 02 June 2005 21:00 
>> To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com 
>> Subject: [sailwave] Re: Qualifications and finals 
>> 
>> 
>> Hi all ! 
>> 
>> Thanks for all the interest shown in this issue ! 
>> Try to answer questions from different posts in one. 
>> 
>> Yes I have talked to Anders about it. It took a while before he 
>> undertood all the finer details of the sailimg instructions but I 
>> think he has got it know :-) 
>> 
>> I dont intend to score 2 sailors the second place without a 
winner in 
>> a race. The situation occurs when ( as anders describes ) we select 
>> all the "worst" sailors from each group of the qualification 
and put 
>> them in the bronze final. Probably noone will have a 1st or 
2nd from 
>> the qualification races among these sailiors. Still they will be in 
>> the same fleet so the current way that SW calulates score 
based om the 
>> recorded position will in my experience produce an in this case 
>> unwanted result. 
>> 
>> In the gold group the problem is not so evident. If there are 3 
>> sailors having 1st in the same race they will all get the 
score of 1.0 
>> - no problem. The problem occurs further down at the bottom of the 
>> gold group where the results are more spread out and even more 
so in 
>> the silver and bronze group. 
>> 
>> So the proposal from Anders : "switch to lock the results in a 
race" 
>> makes a lot of sense to me but of course I cannot judge what 
impact it 
>> would have on the development work. Beeing in the sw business 
I know 
>> that there are no easy changes, just a lot of unrealistic 
demands… 
>> 
>> /jan 
>> 
>> > Hi Martin, 
>> > 
>> > yes I know that but… 
>> > 
>> > the results from round robin changes when scoring in the 
finals (!) 
>> > The results from round robin must not change at all! ALL the 
results 
>> > from round robin goes into the final as they were - there is no 
>> > sequence in the first five races in the finals because some 
of the 
>> > competitors did not meet each other in round robin. 
>> > 
>> > Anders 
>> > 
>> > — In sailwave@yahoogroups.com, "Martin Bølgen" 
<martin@s…> wrote: 
>> > > 
>> > > Hi, Anders. 
>> > > 
>> > > I've tested in v.1.62-1.64. 
>> > > If you do it the way I have described (first one file, 
then split 
>> > into 3 files for the finals. It's "easy" to do with new 
>> > tools/layouts), then you don't gets the result changes! 
>> > > 
>> > > Just set it up as a fleet race all the time. NO flights! And in 
>> > the Qual. use score by field. Then you gets 3 1.st and so on. 
>> > > 
>> > > Martin 
>> > > 
>> > > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- 
>> > > From: "Anders Landenstad" <anders.landenstad@t…> 
>> > > Reply-To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com 
>> > > Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 11:10:57 -0000 
>> > > 
>> > > ><html><body> 
>> > > > 
>> > > > 
>> > > ><tt> 
>> > > >I have done a quick test and found out that we propably need a 
>> > 
>> > > >switch to lock the results in a race, so when pressing "score" 
>> > they 
>> > > >won't change. 
>> > > > 
>> > > >Short breifing … 
>> > > > 
>> > > >About 200 optimist boys will sail a round robin. they 
will be 
>> > > >divided into 3 groups (?) BLUE - GREEN - WHITE. After 5 races 
>> > there 
>> > > >will be three lists of results BLUE - GREEN - WHITE. 
>> > > > 
>> > > >Now it's time for the finals. Each group will now be 
divided into 
>> > 
>> > > >three new groups (?) GOLD - SILVER - BRONZE, so now 1/3 
of blue, 
>> > 
>> > > >green and white will be in the GOLD-final and so on. 
>> > > > 
>> > > >The results from round robin should go into the finals 
whith no 
>> > 
>> > > >changes (!) - There was the switch! 
>> > > > 
>> > > >There will be lots of girls sailing too… 
>> > > > 
>> > > >The regatta starts the last week of june. 
>> > > > 
>> > > >Regards 
>> > > > 
>> > > >Anders Landenstad 
>> > > >Sweden 
>> > > > 
>> > > >— In sailwave@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph Tingle" <rat@a…> 
>> > wrote: 
>> > > >> Hi Jan 
>> > > >> Why would you want to allocate 2nd places without any 
1sts?? 
>> > > >> You are going away from the basic principle of scoring 
>> > > >> Or do you mean race 1 in the finals? 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> Your regatta is a difficult one to score automatically & I'm 
>> > not 
>> > > >sure how to deal with it 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> Regards 
>> > > >> Ralph 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> -----Original Message----- 
>> > > >> From: jan_vasternas [mailto:jv@c…] 
>> > > >> Sent: 01 June 2005 20:48 
>> > > >> To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com 
>> > > >> Subject: [sailwave] Re: Qualifications and finals 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> — In sailwave@yahoogroups.com, "jan_vasternas" <jv@c…> 
>> > wrote: 
>> > > >> > What is the best way to use sailwave in the following 
>> > situation ? 
>> > > >> > 
>> > > >> > The qualification part consists of 5 races with 1 
discard and 
>> > is 
>> > > >> > sailed in three groups. After this the top third of each 
>> > group 
>> > > >sails 
>> > > >> > in the gold fleet the middle third of each group 
sails in the 
>> > 
>> > > >silver 
>> > > >> > and the bottom third in the bronze final. The finals 
consists 
>> > of 
>> > > >5 
>> > > >> races. 
>> > > >> > In the total score all 10 races should be counted with one 
>> > 
>> > > >discard. 
>> > > >> > 
>> > > >> > If each group has 50 sailors the results for a sailor 
in the 
>> > 
>> > > >bronze 
>> > > >> > final could be something like 
>> > > >> > 38, (45), 40, 40, 27, 1, 30, 20, 5, 7 total of 208 
>> > > >> > 
>> > > >> > Any help appreciated. 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> I think my problems boils down to the following: 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> Create a series with one race and two competitors. 
>> > > >> Assign Place 2 to both of the competitors in R1. 
>> > > >> When scoring they will both get 1.0 points and 1.0 as 
nett. 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> If it was possible to configure that Place 2 would score 2.0 
>> > points 
>> > > >> regardless of how other competitors are placed I would be 
>> > happy. 
>> > > >> Perhaps there is is such an option that I have missed ? 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> 
>> > > >> 
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>> > > Martin Bølgen 
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ColinJenkins · 29 June 2005 11:01

You'll maybe want to have your holiday i Norway?

No problem Scoring. I'll manage it anyway, and SW will help me.

regards Martin

Sorry Martin, it was a joke, sometimes my sense of humour doens't tralslate
well...

Colin

PS: But a trip to Norway would be good at some time...

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