[sailwave] Time adjustment

MikeB · 30 November 2012 08:27

The display of the flag can be late hence time redress

···

Sent from my Windows Phone

From:
yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk

Sent:
29/11/2012 22:20

Subject:
RE: [sailwave] Time adjustment

It could be either I. Am thinking of at a redress hearing. It could only be in timed races. This is valid for redress standing by a disabled boat or incorrect ocs. Could have a universal benefit.

Curious how you can be incorrectly OCS. Either you are OCS or not. If you think you are OCS and come back following display of X flag and you weren’t that’s your fault?

Eskdale · 30 November 2012 08:55

OK Thanks,

Having decided that there could be a use for it now to decide whether its worth the effort or if there are work arounds for the few cases, or is it a common case?

I quess if I were to implement it, it would mean two more scoring code Methods. One for actual elapsed time adjustment and one for corrected time adjustment. You would create a new scoring code with this method and when you entered this code you would be prompted to enter the time adjustment. Then there are the problems of how you publish the information. Possible but not a quick job.

Need to decide what gets done next

My List this week looks like

Changes to Sail No Wizard Done

Extra / Alternative Sail no Done

Team Scoring by Position

as well as points Done in 2.7.1 only released to a few for testing.

Entry of Elapsed Time without “:” To be considered

Publish Starts in separate columns

When Merging - Merge ratings

Integrate my other programs tightly with Sailwave

Competitor Database

Remote scoring

Some of those are big ones some are easier - any strong opinions on what I work on this weekend?

Jon

···

On 30 November 2012 08:27, Patricia Butterfield pmbutterfield@msn.com wrote:

The display of the flag can be late hence time redress

Sent from my Windows Phone

From:
yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk

Sent:
29/11/2012 22:20

To:
sailwave@yahoogroups.com

Subject:
RE: [sailwave] Time adjustment

It could be either I. Am thinking of at a redress hearing. It could only be in timed races. This is valid for redress standing by a disabled boat or incorrect ocs. Could have a universal benefit.

Curious how you can be incorrectly OCS. Either you are OCS or not. If you think you are OCS and come back following display of X flag and you weren’t that’s your fault?

–
Jon Eskdale
07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”

mtownsend · 30 November 2012 14:02

Jon,

Here are a few items that I have had on my wish list for some time.

Ability to add a time penalty instead of a points penalty with a letter score. In distance racing when a boat is OCS it is common to give a boat an elapsed time penalty of some number of minutes instead of points equal to one more than the number of starters. Also part two penalties tend to be time based rather than points based.
Ability to select competitors with like characteristics and create an alias fleet. Setting up individual aliases is relatively simple, however it is tedious to create dozens of aliases and combine them into multiple sub-fleets. There are several use cases for this feature.
A) if you have a single start for a fleet of Optimists and want to score red, white, blue and green competitors, as well as girls and boys separately you can create alias sub-fleets for red, white, blue and green competitors, a girls sub-fleet, a boys sub-fleet. This is possible today but very tedious as in a 40 boat fleet you would need to create 80 aliases
B) Distance races often score boats using multiple different rating systems PHRF, IRC, ORR as well as first to finish. Each handicap scheme will result in different finish orders so they need to be calculated and displayed as separate fleets; PHRF, IRC, ORR, Elapsed.

···

To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
From: jon@eskdale.org
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:55:50 +0000
Subject: Re: [sailwave] Time adjustment

OK Thanks,

Having decided that there could be a use for it now to decide whether its worth the effort or if there are work arounds for the few cases, or is it a common case?

I quess if I were to implement it, it would mean two more scoring code Methods. One for actual elapsed time adjustment and one for corrected time adjustment. You would create a new scoring code with this method and when you entered this code you would be prompted to enter the time adjustment. Then there are the problems of how you publish the information. Possible but not a quick job.

Need to decide what gets done next

My List this week looks like

Changes to Sail No Wizard Done

Extra / Alternative Sail no Done

Team Scoring by Position

as well as points Done in 2.7.1 only released to a few for testing.

Entry of Elapsed Time without “:” To be considered

Publish Starts in separate columns

When Merging - Merge ratings

Integrate my other programs tightly with Sailwave

Competitor Database

Remote scoring

Some of those are big ones some are easier - any strong opinions on what I work on this weekend?

Jon

On 30 November 2012 08:27, Patricia Butterfield pmbutterfield@msn.com wrote:

The display of the flag can be late hence time redress

Sent from my Windows Phone

From:
yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk

Sent:
29/11/2012 22:20

To:
sailwave@yahoogroups.com

Subject:
RE: [sailwave] Time adjustment

It could be either I. Am thinking of at a redress hearing. It could only be in timed races. This is valid for redress standing by a disabled boat or incorrect ocs. Could have a universal benefit.

Curious how you can be incorrectly OCS. Either you are OCS or not. If you think you are OCS and come back following display of X flag and you weren’t that’s your fault?

–
Jon Eskdale
07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”

Eskdale · 30 November 2012 14:42

OK Mark,

You have convinced me on the easy creation of Aliases

If I add a new item to the Edit menu (if the Alias option is enabled) that gives New Alias and then displays the box similar to the delete competitor

So in operation you would sort you competitor on the field or 2 fields that you want then select this option

Highlight the competitors that you want to make aliases for (I might try and implement the Shift click to select a range as well) then all the selected ones will have an Alias created for them.

My first thought would be to not display any Aliases in the selection list so when you create an Alias it is always from the Master. That makes the selection list easier and probably less confusing than allowing Aliases of Aliases.

That shouldn’t be too difficult

The Time correction I will also do but that might take a bit longer and do you agree it needs both Elapsed and corrected time options?

Jon

···

On 30 November 2012 14:02, Mark Townsend s_mark_townsend@hotmail.com wrote:

Jon,

Here are a few items that I have had on my wish list for some time.

Ability to add a time penalty instead of a points penalty with a letter score. In distance racing when a boat is OCS it is common to give a boat an elapsed time penalty of some number of minutes instead of points equal to one more than the number of starters. Also part two penalties tend to be time based rather than points based.

Ability to select competitors with like characteristics and create an alias fleet. Setting up individual aliases is relatively simple, however it is tedious to create dozens of aliases and combine them into multiple sub-fleets. There are several use cases for this feature.

A) if you have a single start for a fleet of Optimists and want to score red, white, blue and green competitors, as well as girls and boys separately you can create alias sub-fleets for red, white, blue and green competitors, a girls sub-fleet, a boys sub-fleet. Thi
s is possible today but very tedious as in a 40 boat fleet you would need to create 80 aliases
B) Distance races often score boats using multiple different rating systems PHRF, IRC, ORR as well as first to finish. Each handicap scheme will result in different finish orders so they need to be calculated and displayed as separate fleets; PHRF, IRC, ORR, Elapsed.

To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
From: jon@eskdale.org
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:55:50 +0000

Subject: Re: [sailwave] Time adjustment

OK Thanks,

Having decided that there could be a use for it now to decide whether its worth the effort or if there are work arounds for the few cases, or is it a common case?

I quess if I were to implement it, it would mean two more scoring code Methods. One for actual elapsed time adjustment and one for corrected time adjustment. You would create a new scoring code with this method and when you entered this code you would be prompted to enter the time adjustment. Then there are the problems of how you publish the information. Possible but not a quick job.

Need to decide what gets done next

My List this week looks like

Changes to Sail No Wizard Done

Extra / Alternative Sail no Done

Team Scoring by Position

as well as points Done in 2.7.1 only released to a few for testing.

Entry of Elapsed Time without “:” To be considered

Publish Starts in separate columns

When Merging - Merge ratings

Integrate my other programs tightly with Sailwave

Competitor Database

Remote scoring

Some of those are big ones some are easier - any strong opinions on what I work on this weekend?

Jon

On 30 November 2012 08:27, Patricia Butterfield pmbutterfield@msn.com wrote:

The display of the flag can be late hence time redress

Sent from my Windows Phone

From:
yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk

Sent:
29/11/2012 22:20

To:
sailwave@yahoogroups.com

Subject:
RE: [sailwave] Time adjustment

It could be either I. Am thinking of at a redress hearing. It could only be in timed races. This is valid for redress standing by a disabled boat or incorrect ocs. Could have a universal benefit.

Curious how you can be incorrectly OCS. Either you are OCS or not. If you think you are OCS and come back following display of X flag and you weren’t that’s your fault?

–
Jon Eskdale
07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”

MikeB · 30 November 2012 15:26

on elapsed probably more of a priority.

The handicap cuts in after on scoring.

Mike B

···

From: Jon Eskdale

Sent: Friday, November 30, 2012 2:42 PM

To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com

Subject: Re: [sailwave] Time adjustment

OK Mark,

You have convinced me on the easy creation of Aliases

If I add a new item to the Edit menu (if the Alias option is enabled) that gives New Alias and then displays the box similar to the delete competitor

So in operation you would sort you competitor on the field or 2 fields that you want then select this option

Highlight the competitors that you want to make aliases for (I might try and implement the Shift click to select a range as well) then all the selected ones will have an Alias created for them.

My first thought would be to not display any Aliases in the selection list so when you create an Alias it is always from the Master. That makes the selection list easier and probably less confusing than allowing Aliases of Aliases.

That shouldn’t be too difficult

The Time correction I will also do but that might take a bit longer and do you agree it needs both Elapsed and corrected time options?

Jon

On 30 November 2012 14:02, Mark Townsend s_mark_townsend@hotmail.com wrote:

Jon,

Here are a few items that I have had on my wish list for some time.

Ability to add a time penalty instead of a points penalty with a letter score. In distance racing when a boat is OCS it is common to give a boat an elapsed time penalty of some number of minutes instead of points equal to one more than the number of starters. Also part two penalties tend to be time based rather than points based.

Ability to select competitors with like characteristics and create an alias fleet. Setting up individual aliases is relatively simple, however it is tedious to create dozens of aliases and combine them into multiple sub-fleets. There are several use cases for this feature.
A) if you have a single start for a fleet of Optimists and want to score red, white, blue and green competitors, as well as girls and boys separately you can create alias sub-fleets for red, white, blue and green competitors, a girls sub-fleet, a boys sub-fleet. Thi s is possible today but very tedious as in a 40 boat fleet you would need to create 80 aliases
B) Distance races often score boats using multiple different rating systems PHRF, IRC, ORR as well as first to finish. Each handicap scheme will result in different finish orders so they need to be calculated and displayed as separate fleets; PHRF, IRC, ORR, Elapsed.

To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
From: jon@eskdale.org
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:55:50 +0000

Subject: Re: [sailwave] Time adjustment

OK Thanks,

Having decided that there could be a use for it now to decide whether its worth the effort or if there are work arounds for the few cases, or is it a common case?

I quess if I were to implement it, it would mean two more scoring code Methods. One for actual elapsed time adjustment and one for corrected time adjustment. You would create a new scoring code with this method and when you entered this code you would be prompted to enter the time adjustment. Then there are the problems of how you publish the information. Possible but not a quick job.

Need to decide what gets done next

My List this week looks like

Changes to Sail No Wizard Done

Extra / Alternative Sail no Done

Team Scoring by Position

as well as points Done in 2.7.1 only released to a few for testing.

Entry of Elapsed Time without “:” To be considered

Publish Starts in separate columns

When Merging - Merge ratings

Integrate my other programs tightly with Sailwave

Competitor Database

Remote scoring

Some of those are big ones some are easier - any strong opinions on what I work on this weekend?

Jon

On 30 November 2012 08:27, Patricia Butterfield pmbutterfield@msn.com wrote:

The display of the flag can be late hence time redress
Sent from my Windows Phone

From: yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk
Sent:     29/11/2012 22:20
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Subject:     RE: [sailwave] Time adjustment

  It could be either I. Am thinking of at a redress hearing. It could only be in timed races. This is valid for redress standing by a disabled boat or incorrect ocs. Could have a universal benefit.

Curious how you can be incorrectly OCS.  Either you are OCS or not.  If you think you are OCS and come back following display of X flag and you weren't that's your fault?

–
Jon Eskdale
07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”

–
Jon Eskdale
07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”

mtownsend · 30 November 2012 18:04

A good example of what can be achieved using Aliases can be seen at the ABYC website. We had 108 competitors, 78 races which were scored as aliases as A fleet, B fleet, Junior fleet and Women’s fleet. It took a long time to setup the 138 aliases needed to make it all work.

If you could use a dialog similar to the set competitor field to select the competitors for a alias fleet.

http://www.abyc.org/upload/2010_Lido_14_Twilights_Overall_09-29.htm

Mark Townsend
Phone: 562-433-4366

Cell: 562-533-5909
Email: s_mark_townsend@hotmail.com

···

From: sailwave@yahoogroups.com [mailto:sailwave@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jon Eskdale
Sent: Friday, November 30, 2012 6:43 AM
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sailwave] Time adjustment

OK Mark,

You have convinced me on the easy creation of Aliases

If I add a new item to the Edit menu (if the Alias option is enabled) that gives New Alias and then displays the box similar to the delete competitor

So in operation you would sort you competitor on the field or 2 fields that you want then select this option

Highlight the competitors that you want to make aliases for (I might try and implement the Shift click to select a range as well) then all the selected ones will have an Alias created for them.

My first thought would be to not display any Aliases in the selection list so when you create an Alias it is always from the Master. That makes the selection list easier and probably less confusing than allowing Aliases of Aliases.

That shouldn’t be too difficult

The Time correction I will also do but that might take a bit longer and do you agree it needs both Elapsed and corrected time options?

Jon

On 30 November 2012 14:02, Mark Townsend s_mark_townsend@hotmail.com wrote:

Jon,

Here are a few items that I have had on my wish list for some time.

Ability to add a time penalty instead of a points penalty with a letter score. In distance racing when a boat is OCS it is common to give a boat an elapsed time penalty of some number of minutes instead of points equal to one more than the number of starters. Also part two penalties tend to be time based rather than points based.
Ability to select competitors with like characteristics and create an alias fleet. Setting up individual aliases is relatively simple, however it is tedious to create dozens of aliases and combine them into multiple sub-fleets. There are several use cases for this feature.
A) if you have a single start for a fleet of Optimists and want to score red, white, blue and green competitors, as well as girls and boys separately you can create alias sub-fleets for red, white, blue and green competitors, a girls sub-fleet, a boys sub-fleet. Thi s is possible today but very tedious as in a 40 boat fleet you would need to create 80 aliases
B) Distance races often score boats using multiple different rating systems PHRF, IRC, ORR as well as first to finish. Each handicap scheme will result in different finish orders so they need to be calculated and displayed as separate fleets; PHRF, IRC, ORR, Elapsed.

To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
From: jon@eskdale.org
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 08:55:50 +0000

Subject: Re: [sailwave] Time adjustment

OK Thanks,

Having decided that there could be a use for it now to decide whether its worth the effort or if there are work arounds for the few cases, or is it a common case?

I quess if I were to implement it, it would mean two more scoring code Methods. One for actual elapsed time adjustment and one for corrected time adjustment. You would create a new scoring code with this method and when you entered this code you would be prompted to enter the time adjustment. Then there are the problems of how you publish the information. Possible but not a quick job.

Need to decide what gets done next

My List this week looks like

Changes to Sail No Wizard Done

Extra / Alternative Sail no Done

Team Scoring by Position

as well as points Done in 2.7.1 only released to a few for testing.

Entry of Elapsed Time without “:” To be considered

Publish Starts in separate columns

When Merging - Merge ratings

Integrate my other programs tightly with Sailwave

Competitor Database

Remote scoring

Some of those are big ones some are easier - any strong opinions on what I work on this weekend?

Jon

On 30 November 2012 08:27, Patricia Butterfield pmbutterfield@msn.com wrote:

The display of the flag can be late hence time redress

Sent from my Windows Phone

From: yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk
Sent: 29/11/2012 22:20
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [sailwave] Time adjustment

It could be either I. Am thinking of at a redress hearing. It could only be in timed races. This is valid for redress standing by a disabled boat or incorrect ocs. Could have a universal benefit.

Curious how you can be incorrectly OCS. Either you are OCS or not. If you think you are OCS and come back following display of X flag and you weren’t that’s your fault?

–
Jon Eskdale

07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”

–
Jon Eskdale

07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”

mtownsend · 30 November 2012 19:05

Elapsed time is the more common use. Below are examples of sailing instructions that modify the penalty to OCS.

Newport to Ensenada yacht Race

http://www.nosa.org/assets/SI-2012-Amended.pdf

9.2 Any boat that is on the course side at her starting signal, or must comply with RRS 30.1, or starts on the wrong line, that does not return to the pre—start side of the line to properly start, will be scored OCS and penalized sixty (60) minutes of elapsed time in lieu of being scored points for the finishing place one more than the number of boats entered in the race. This changes RRS 28.1 and RRS A4.2.

Vic Maui Race

http://www.vicmaui.org/pdfs/VM2012%20Sailing%20Instructions.pdf

12.2.5 Failing to sail the course rule 28.1; SI’s 6 “Start Line” and 9 “Course and Time Limit”.

a) On course side at start signal (OCS) and failing to return

(i) less than 1 minute OCS … 2 hours

x(ii) 1min. to 4 minutes OCS … 5 hours

(iii) Over 4 minutes OCS … DSQ

12.3 All time penalties shall be added to a boat’s elapsed time.

Nawiliwili Yacht Club Lihue, Kauai, Hawaii

http://www.nawiliwiliyachtclub.org/2012-racing/KCR/2012%20KCR%20Sailing%20instructions.pdf

8.2 A boat starting On the Course Side (OCS) at the start and failing to return shall be penalized by having thirty minutes added to her elapsed time. This changes RRS 28.2, 29.1, and Appendix A5.

Mark Townsend
Phone: 562-433-4366

Cell: 562-533-5909
Email: s_mark_townsend@hotmail.com

···

From: sailwave@yahoogroups.com [mailto:sailwave@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jon Eskdale
Sent: Friday, November 30, 2012 12:56 AM
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sailwave] Time adjustment

OK Thanks,

Having decided that there could be a use for it now to decide whether its worth the effort or if there are work arounds for the few cases, or is it a common case?

I quess if I were to implement it, it would mean two more scoring code Methods. One for actual elapsed time adjustment and one for corrected time adjustment. You would create a new scoring code with this method and when you entered this code you would be prompted to enter the time adjustment. Then there are the problems of how you publish the information. Possible but not a quick job.

Need to decide what gets done next

My List this week looks like

Changes to Sail No Wizard Done

Extra / Alternative Sail no Done

Team Scoring by Position

as well as points Done in 2.7.1 only released to a few for testing.

Entry of Elapsed Time without “:” To be considered

Publish Starts in separate columns

When Merging - Merge ratings

Integrate my other programs tightly with Sailwave

Competitor Database

Remote scoring

Some of those are big ones some are easier - any strong opinions on what I work on this weekend?

Jon

On 30 November 2012 08:27, Patricia Butterfield pmbutterfield@msn.com wrote:

The display of the flag can be late hence time redress

Sent from my Windows Phone

From: yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk
Sent: 29/11/2012 22:20
To: sailwave@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [sailwave] Time adjustment

It could be either I. Am thinking of at a redress hearing. It could only be in timed races. This is valid for redress standing by a disabled boat or incorrect ocs. Could have a universal benefit.

Curious how you can be incorrectly OCS. Either you are OCS or not. If you think you are OCS and come back following display of X flag and you weren’t that’s your fault?

–
Jon Eskdale

07976 709777

Skype “eskdale”