There are differences between high level international racing and club racing.
Not only the skills of the competitors is not the same, but also availability of crews for racing is not the same, and probably boats in club racing are not very well prepared, s the rate of bad regattas, with abandonments of just out of time limits is higher.
So if ISAF low point matches the needs of top level, it just doesn’t work properly for club racing.
Discards must be used according to the level of the regatta, very low number for high level (ISAF tries to reduce to 1 discard in top events), it is a standard for national regattas to use int(r^.5-1), it means 1 discard from 4 races, 2 from 9, 3 from 16. But for club racing, even within in a regatta, it is normal to plan more discards. For series lasting longer than a regatta, whether the ranking is done on each individual race or on the rankings in the regattas, it is not uncommon to have a fixed number of regattas (discard profile 0,0,0,0,0,1,2,3,4,5…), or a percentage profile, sometimes lower than 50%, in the Micro Class, the European ranking is on a fixed number 3 results out of 6 to 8, it is planned to increase to 4 if the number of regattas is increasing or minimum 40%, an attempt to increase the number induced a decrease in participation as most of the competitors found it too expensive to sail for this ranking, and they focussed on national regattas instead; the French ranking is made on the best 4 out of 12, the Belgian ranking on at least 60% of the number of regattas, one additional result being the best achieved in a foreign national or international regatta.
Your critics are based on the fact that you beat the top racers of your club while the others are not participating.
This is statistically irrealistic, otherwise you should only sail international regattas… I understand that if I beat in the same regatta both Tom Slingsby and Paul Goodison in a regatta of 3, I would be very disappointed if someone else beating me and the other worse sailors of the World in a regatta of 25 gets more points.
But I’m also sure I won’t do it twice, and on the long run I think the system is fair, at least on this side of the ranking.
The problem with these high point scorings is that when the same regattas have low participation every year, and worse results are discarded, so for the best competitors they are not interesting and participation decreases, it requires a huge effort from the organising authority to turn the trend and attract more competitors again, usually they are attracting very low level competitors to make the number, than the top ones, being beaten by lower skill crews, come back the year after.
Phil
···
----- Original Message -----
From: “Calum Polwart” yahoo@wittongilbert.free-online.co.uk
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 9:55 AM
Subject: Re: [sailwave] Re: chipestaed siling clunb chips scoring
Philippe DE TROY wrote:
I think the weakness of Chips is not on that side of the table.
Ranking on 6 regattas, 4 with 3 boats, 2 with 25 boats (not pure
imagination; it happens when there is a club regatta every sunday, even
when there is a national regatta organised by THE SAME CLUB on THE SAME
DAY, I’ve seen it; only the 3 worse crews entered the club regatta)…
And even in those conditions, the crew of boat A NEVER finishes within
time limit.(6 times, 52.6+52.6+52.6+52.6+6.3+6.3=223.0)
This boat is ranked far before ALL others having sailed the national
regattas (1st in Races 5 and 6 just scores 99.7+99.7=199.4).Phil
The fundamental problem is not the points system - its allowing people
in the series who don’t complete enough races…!2 Races out of 6! On a Low Points system you’d surely have a 3 or 4 of
6 races to count (i.e. discard 2 or 3 races).OK so someone who DNFs maybe shouldn’t get overly credited for starting.
But there is a point to be made here - on one hand David is saying
CHIPS discourages people from sailing, on the other hand we are clearly
saying it rewards people for coming out and making the effort to start.If you include discards in high points then 4 of 6 races gives the first
boat 210.4 points (still beats the other boat - but he hadn’t qualified
for the series) Had the other boat taken part in any of the other races
even if they DNFd they’d have had more points. 3 of 6 races 157.8 (the
other example beats them but didn’t qualify for the series, had they
taken part in any other race they’d qualify and so beat him) and 2 of 6
- 105.2 (the other boat qualifies AND beats him)
Am I missing something - why you shouldn’t include discards in a high
points system?Clearly if the two 25 boat races were at the start of the season and you
only needed 2 of 6 to qualify the positions are set for the season from
the start…
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